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ReMaXeD

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ehhx

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We all know where this is going aren't we  8)
No point debating about this guy because he wanted some prize keys and cheated for it
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 10:31:22 AM by ehhx »


ehhx

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And also TAS parts are recorded segment by segment so you have to do the connectors yourself (unless you record the connectors too) then to get to another point where you can reuse TAS again at a certain point. So the failed part on the _above run is not a valid excuse. So what about casuals run on skylight? You may ask. Plugins like jsave are what allows runs like that to be created.
Feel free to correct me lol
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 11:41:15 AM by ehhx »


RNC1839

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And also TAS parts are recorded segment by segment so you have to do the connectors yourself (unless you record the connectors too) then to get to another point where you can reuse TAS again at a certain point. So the failed part on the _above run is not a valid excuse. So what about casuals run on skylight? You may ask. Plugins like jsave are what allows runs like that to be created.
Feel free to correct me lol
Some of this is wrong.

Jsave can be used for TAS's. That's how I did my internal_b3 TAS. But it requires heavy video editing to cut out failures, which implies that both Brock and Sitood were in on the entire thing, and I don't think that's the case. It's the same as making a map showcase just more speedrunny. Prior to the recent update to jsave, there would be no way to go back to a run unless you were on the ground, not moving, and knew that exact position (which is really easy to find) or are about to do a rocket jump. But with the addition of jexport you can go back after a week and continue working on it.

Casual's plugin is a lot more like an actual TAS. When someone uses the plugin they create a psuedo-demo file. It's like a demo because you can play it back and it will show exactly the same thing every single time, and you close tf2 and watch it a week later and it'll be the same. But I added the 'psuedo' because segments can be rewritten, rerecorded, and improved. Once the psuedo-demo is finished the person could then record a regular demo while the psuedo-demo plays. Obsiidian used it for the apex showcase so he actually knows some of how it works, better than I do.

The only reason the thing on jump_above is being considered semilegit is because a perfect TAS wouldn't have that. My internal TAS has one and that isn't even close to a perfect run. But since we all know what a perfect TAS should basically look like that sort of issue shouldn't exist, and it's only in there to through off the chance of it being a TAS. It looks more human that way.


I don't know the full limitations of his plugin, but in theory more than 1 person could share a psuedo-demo and all those people could work on it together to work out any time losses, and even finish the run weeks before the deadline. In the principle of non-segmented non-TAS speedrunning, that would just be complete bullshit.

And all of that is assuming they used casual's plugin. It's possible someone else made their own version that does basically the same thing. No one knows for sure other than the guys behind it. What's much more likely though is that someone, who shouldn't have it, got the plugin and is now being a complete asshat.

The skylight run was done using casual's pluign not jsave.


On a slightly different note there was no POV demo for either of nico's runs (and I'm going to guess that there is no apex one either). So there is no way to see the tick by tick inputs from the player (that I know of).

OR this whole thing is just some guy no one has heard of that just showed up out of nowhere, and somehow knows how to record STV's but not POV's.

quick edit: I forgot to mention Jsave demos need to be chopped up a bunch and Casual plugin demos are smooth and look just like the videos. Which is why the skylight run had 1 single smooth demo.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 12:47:22 PM by RNC1839 »



879m

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Well this has turned into a shitfest. I think some people are forgetting how relatively small this community is. The chance that one person tried to pass off TAS as legit? Pretty small. The chance that a second person tries to pass TAS off as legit? Non-existent in my opinion.


RNC1839

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The chance that one person tried to pass off TAS as legit?

One person has already done that 4 times. Void, Ultra, Skylight, and Aperture.

The chance that a second person tries to pass TAS off as legit?

That one person threatened to release his plugin to the public. And to my knowledge only 2 people (casual and obsidiian) have it. I have no idea who has it beyond those 2 people. And Obsidiian wouldn't cheat in his own damn competition.


879m

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The chance that one person tried to pass off TAS as legit?

One person has already done that 4 times. Void, Ultra, Skylight, and Aperture.

Doesn't sound so good when it's taken out of context. Also I said *tried*, I'm aware of a few past attempts.

And just for clarity I'm meaning runs created by casuals plugin or the like.


cody

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there is a jumper illuminati and im the grand master



ReMaXeD

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The five stages of reacting to fake TAS runs.
Denial - "Come on, there's no way other people could cheat the sanctity of jump."
Anger - "Who else knew you were cheating? We need to mass ban these people!"
Bargaining - "As long as its not released or shared, I guess it's okay."
Depression - "This community is dead, jump is dead, rip skill'
Acceptance - *moves on with day*

It's a known fact that faking offline runs is possible nowadays.  If done well(like casual), even demo files can look legitimate.  That being said, I don't agree with dismissing skepticism if a situation invites it.  To a fair amount of people, this appears to be one such situation.  A jumper under an alias that isn't known among the community, has never posted on this website, and does not care to prove their ability to others is suspicious.

The runs were presented without demos, which has further caused many people's imaginations to run wild. 
Did he use a plugin? | Were the event organizers in on it? | How do we know the runs are legit?

Where can we go from there?  Nowhere.  This is as far as reasoning can takes us.  Discussing it further is just dramatizing the situation(which many seem content with). 

Debating a situation with inadequate information is a waste of time.  Until one of the involved parties decides to acknowledge or refute these suspicions, nothing more will be accomplished.

That being said, I hope to see this community move on.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 04:36:15 PM by ReMaXeD »


Oatmeal

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The five stages of reacting to fake TAS runs.
Denial - "Come on, there's no way other people could cheat the sanctity of jump."
Anger - "Who else knew you were cheating? We need to mass ban these people!"
Bargaining - "As long as its not released or shared, I guess it's okay."
Depression - "This community is dead, jump is dead, rip skill'
Acceptance - *moves on with day*

It's a known fact that faking offline runs is possible nowadays.  If done well(like casual), even demo files can look legitimate.  That being said, I don't agree with dismissing skepticism if a situation invites it.  To a fair amount of people, this appears to be one such situation.  A jumper under an alias that isn't known among the community, has never posted on this website, and does not care to prove their ability to others is suspicious.

The runs were presented without demos, which has further caused many people's imaginations to run wild. 
Did he use a plugin? | Were the event organizers in on it? | How do we know the runs are legit?

Where can we go from there?  Nowhere.  This is as far as reasoning can takes us.  Discussing it further is just dramatizing the situation(which many seem content with). 

Debating a situation with inadequate information is a waste of time.  Until one of the involved parties decides to acknowledge or refute these suspicions, nothing more will be accomplished.

That being said, I hope to see this community move on.

I agree with everything you just said.


John

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The five stages of reacting to fake TAS runs.
Denial - "Come on, there's no way other people could cheat the sanctity of jump."
Anger - "Who else knew you were cheating? We need to mass ban these people!"
Bargaining - "As long as its not released or shared, I guess it's okay."
Depression - "This community is dead, jump is dead, rip skill'
Acceptance - *moves on with day*

It's a known fact that faking offline runs is possible nowadays.  If done well(like casual), even demo files can look legitimate.  That being said, I don't agree with dismissing skepticism if a situation invites it.  To a fair amount of people, this appears to be one such situation.  A jumper under an alias that isn't known among the community, has never posted on this website, and does not care to prove their ability to others is suspicious.

The runs were presented without demos, which has further caused many people's imaginations to run wild. 
Did he use a plugin? | Were the event organizers in on it? | How do we know the runs are legit?

Where can we go from there?  Nowhere.  This is as far as reasoning can takes us.  Discussing it further is just dramatizing the situation(which many seem content with). 

Debating a situation with inadequate information is a waste of time.  Until one of the involved parties decides to acknowledge or refute these suspicions, nothing more will be accomplished.

That being said, I hope to see this community move on.

finally someone understands


Trude

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The five stages of reacting to fake TAS runs.
Denial - "Come on, there's no way other people could cheat the sanctity of jump."
Anger - "Who else knew you were cheating? We need to mass ban these people!"
Bargaining - "As long as its not released or shared, I guess it's okay."
Depression - "This community is dead, jump is dead, rip skill'
Acceptance - *moves on with day*

It's a known fact that faking offline runs is possible nowadays.  If done well(like casual), even demo files can look legitimate.  That being said, I don't agree with dismissing skepticism if a situation invites it.  To a fair amount of people, this appears to be one such situation.  A jumper under an alias that isn't known among the community, has never posted on this website, and does not care to prove their ability to others is suspicious.

The runs were presented without demos, which has further caused many people's imaginations to run wild. 
Did he use a plugin? | Were the event organizers in on it? | How do we know the runs are legit?

Where can we go from there?  Nowhere.  This is as far as reasoning can takes us.  Discussing it further is just dramatizing the situation(which many seem content with). 

Debating a situation with inadequate information is a waste of time.  Until one of the involved parties decides to acknowledge or refute these suspicions, nothing more will be accomplished.

That being said, I hope to see this community move on.

Problem being, most never get past step 2. If the collective internet ever comes to grip with tas runs, I will stuff my keyboard into the garbage disposal and take up base jumping.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 08:34:08 PM by Trude »


Nico

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This is Shiny / ยต% / Way. A few people might know me. I registered with my Nico account, have John or someone check.

I guarantee everyone here there was no TAS or other foul play/cheating involved at all. I will bet my life on it. I ran everything legit. If you want to review demos looking for sketchy shit, go ahead. That's none of my business.

There's no POV demos for elephant and above because I'm a fucking dumbass and overwrote the demos of the runs. This is the only thing I regret, I'm very very sorry. If you hate me for that, I'd understand. There's still the apex POV though. It shouldn't be too hard to get I hope.

Also RNC you're a little bitch for banning me and Ak for literally no reason?? Hello what the fuck is wrong with you?
I'm so sorry I recommended you to take over BBHoD. Go fuck yourself, no one likes you.