New Jump Style Idea... Sorta

New Jump Style Idea... Sorta
« on: February 21, 2012, 06:47:03 PM »

Soldier

Posts: 247

So I have been lurking lately, but off and on been thinking about new and interesting ways to create new jumps and whatnot. In the past year or so there have been a fair number of things to change how people jump and overall the community's skill has increased.

There have been a few sandbox jump maps (or freestyle if you prefer) over the years and they mainly do not get played. I have a couple theories on that, one being that the openness and lack of a goal makes people not that interested in trying to create their own challenges or jumps in their mind. Then again, some people just don't like the sandbox style, which is all well and good.

Anyway, long story short an idea (or partial idea) I've been thinking about, and this is more catered toward the speedrunnning side of the community (cause who doesn't like a little friendly competition right?!), is checkpoint jumping.

Please watch the first 20 seconds (or more if you really want) of the video to see what I mean.


Gotham City Impostors Challenges: Ace Chemicals Gold Medal Guide (Beginner/Intermediate/Expert)	Small \| Large

Now there are a few ways to implement this idea, some more complicated then others.

Doing it map side with triggers for doing inmap timing would be one way -- think old school bhoping. Downside would be it may be limited to single player.

Doing it server side with a plugin (think Cranck's timer, with expanded support on the checkpoint aspect of his plugin). Downside is that this might require more coding to work more seamlessly

Overall there are a few maps that could have checkpoints added to them via plugin and then it would be good. Maps could also be created specifically for this for more interesting "courses". Refer to the video again. These don't have to be hard jumps, or necessarily long courses, just something to maybe breath life back into the speed running side of the community again.

What are some of your thoughts on this?

tl:dr -- watch the first 20 secs of the vid. This is the idea put into jump maps for speed running.

Diddy	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #1 on: February 22, 2012, 04:21:04 AM »
Rocketeer Posts: 297	Hmmm not really sure I understand what you mean, rather what it would change with current jump maps. Seems like all you could do would still be just beat the map, because it's not like there are multiple routes on most jumps, so there's really only one way you could go. It just seems like unless there are maps designed around it, it wouldn't really change anything. Maybe I don't fully understand what the intentions are for it, I'd need an example to really understand what it would be like. Could be cool on freestyle maps though, maybe that's what you meant? Sort of like individual courses on them, that's the only way I see it working with current maps. Would also be nice just to see freestyle maps back on the server again « Last Edit: February 22, 2012, 04:24:26 AM by DiddyKong FTW » --------------------------- some people just shouldnt be aloud to have internet accesss

CrancK	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #2 on: February 22, 2012, 04:51:59 AM »
Rocketeer ehh... what? Posts: 397 dude...	ye could be good, best way to do it is to have both plugin + map maker do stuff, like plugin does the actual timer/checkpointy thing, while mapmaker makes the triggers for them in theory skillsrank can already do this (but without mapmaker making the triggers, which would mean annoying placement and size of triggers, skillsrank also doesnt have checkpoint times stored though, so it hasn't got it completely) ---------------------------

Drexen	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #3 on: February 22, 2012, 06:10:49 AM »
Rocketeer Posts: 283	cool idea, would like to see something of it. but also it would mean making some freestyle maps?

CrancK	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #4 on: February 22, 2012, 07:25:05 AM »
Rocketeer ehh... what? Posts: 397 dude...	well, you could also put like checkpoints on normal maps (like dustbowl/goldrush etc), if you make it so all the gates are down i guess ---------------------------

dellort	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #5 on: February 22, 2012, 02:55:15 PM »
Rocketeer Video Maker Extraordinaire Posts: 294	I think we just need a better variety of maps. Jumping can really be divided up into three different "divisions", which would be: skill jumping - which is basically what most of jumping is today, the goal being to beat different jumps, speed or creativity isn't really a focus freestyle jumping - basically jump_trix, jump_ra3map4, and most non-jump maps work to some degree speed jumping - which would be like defrag_xelerate or defrag_pizzanbeer, the main focus being the speed in which the map is done as opposed to the difficulty of the jumps these three overlap of course, freestyle jumps can be done on skill jump maps, speed runs can be done on skill jump maps, freestyle jumping in speed jump maps, etc. The point I'm trying to make though is that it would be better to focus on building maps to suit each style, rather than implementing mods to force maps to fit a certain style. The CS:S surf community seems to release a new surf map every week or so, which I think is the main reason the surf servers there are constantly filled (I mean the main ksf server has 46 slots, and I can't get in half the time). Obviously their playerbase is much bigger so trying to produce one jump map a week would be a bit unrealistic, but tf2 could certainly do a better job as it is. It really is down to the maps, I know people hate me comparing tf2 jump to CS:S surfing, but I think it's useful to compare the two communities. tl;dr: make more maps ok « Last Edit: February 22, 2012, 03:00:26 PM by dellort »

Dr. Whooo	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #6 on: February 22, 2012, 07:58:28 PM »
Soldier Posts: 247	dell since i dont have time to reply fully and explain more atm... I think your missing the point here. Its not something to restrict things more. Think jump_adria, except more open maybe to break this idea down barney style. I do understand what you are meaning though, more maps is always a good thing. This is more just something to expand and improve on one aspect of jumping that has been neglected lately. -edit-- and something that could be applied to existing maps as well « Last Edit: February 22, 2012, 08:03:31 PM by drwhooo »

Drexen	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #7 on: February 23, 2012, 06:24:28 AM »
Rocketeer Posts: 283	Quote from: dellort on February 22, 2012, 02:55:15 PM tl;dr: make more maps ok and as always, easier said than done

dellort	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #8 on: February 23, 2012, 03:05:31 PM »
Rocketeer Video Maker Extraordinaire Posts: 294	Quote from: Drexen on February 23, 2012, 06:24:28 AM Quote from: dellort on February 22, 2012, 02:55:15 PM tl;dr: make more maps ok and as always, easier said than done Not if more people actually bothered to try mapping (I know that's hypocritcal coming from me, still true though).

Dr. Whooo	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #9 on: February 29, 2012, 09:05:20 PM »
Soldier Posts: 247	So as I keep thinking about this and how I would idealy like to do it, I need a few things answered (I have a map and a tenative course I would like to make). To Cranck (if you dont answer here ill eventually bug you on steam, but I dont have lots of time lately...) Do you have any interest in working on skillsrank more? I dont really know how much work would need to be done to make it as seemless as possible, so a mapper can just add certain ent's that talk to your plug. Are you able to delete ent (or a range of ent - given a certain naming convention)? Is it possible to outline ent/models similar to how the intel in a map is? (where you can see it through walls and what not) To other mappers more firmiliar with ent triggers and logic than I am: Anyone know of a way to setup a checkpoint system with in map timer? I have a few ideas how it might work, but not sure if it would be possible. I dont really know what limits there are. Anyone else have any input on this feel free. In a few days Ill try to outline what I think would be the best way to implement this and set it up for other ppl to make maps using this system (I would make a dev map with all the ent's that ppl can copy from to drop in thier own...)

Drexen	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #10 on: March 01, 2012, 06:55:32 AM »
Rocketeer Posts: 283	Just to say im happy to help, so just ask if you need anything...

CrancK	Re: New Jump Style Idea... Sorta « Reply #11 on: March 02, 2012, 02:26:06 PM »
Rocketeer ehh... what? Posts: 397 dude...	Quote Do you have any interest in working on skillsrank more? I dont really know how much work would need to be done to make it as seemless as possible, so a mapper can just add certain ent's that talk to your plug. Are you able to delete ent (or a range of ent - given a certain naming convention)? Is it possible to outline ent/models similar to how the intel in a map is? (where you can see it through walls and what not) I dont really want to have to do much if anything with skillsrank really... it's just... not fun however yes it would be possible, Deleting ents even a range of them is possible, and outlining "should" be possible, because ive seen a snippet for it somewhere, but i have not tried it myself yet, so i cant say anything bout how well it works/bugs/etc ---------------------------

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